The mother and the widow of the late journalist are perhaps the most interested parties in the Gongadze case because they want a full-scale investigation. In an interview with The Day Lesia Gongadze questions a number of aspects relating to the case and the rule of law in Ukraine. She isn’t satisfied with and refuses to be misled by any declarations that the Gongadze case has finally been solved or by any statements about the “supreme political expedience” of avoiding a straight answer to a straight question about who ordered the journalist’s murder. All she wants is the truth.
Mrs. Gongadze, today (July 8 — Ed.) you have agreed to DNA testing for the fifth time. Do you still hope to establish the truth?
L.G.: I’m simply a mother who wants to know where her son is buried. I often hear people describing me as a courageous and strong- willed woman, but this is only what meets the eye. Deep inside I’m burned out. On one occasion I found myself surrounded by women who wanted to touch me to share my energy and willpower. They said they needed this to recharge themselves. Yes, I want to know the truth, so I’m sticking to hard facts. True, the remains that were subjected to forensic medical examinations show that the right upper limb has an old injury that my son sustained in Sukhumi in 1993. But the foot and the toes don’t belong to my Giya. How can a mother mistake her son’s toes for someone else’s? My son suffered from foot eczema and the feet of that body didn’t have it.
Although DNA testing can’t guarantee 100% identification, I agreed to a DNA test for the fifth time. An official from the General Prosecutor’s Office arrived, along with a special investigating officer. I’m not sure, but I noticed that they weren’t looking me straight in the eyes. If so, the show is still going on.
But I agreed to that blood test. Believe me, the procedure isn’t pleasant, although it’s a simple one, medically speaking; they finally promised to do a hair analysis and test the bones in the foot, the heel. This can yield 100% identification.
You mean that you still hope to bury your son, and that perhaps not just the murderers but also those who ordered the killing will be brought to justice? They’re supposedly searching for them.
L.G.: Please understand that no one is hunting anyone; everybody understands the situation. They’re just going through the motions of investigating the case and everybody has their interests to pursue. After all has been said and done, no one (I mean the government) gives a hoot about me, and the same is true of Giya. But if you want power, when you are a slave to that desire, you will resort to any degree of hypocrisy. Some have left, others have arrived. I was first used by one opposition and then by the next one. The people, however, make up an inscrutable force and those who are trying to play games with them are sure to end up on the losing side. I’ve gone through the school of Georgia, I saw Gamsakhurdiya juggling with his people, and now I’m watching Saakashvili do the same.
After Kravchenko’s death, even more people have started thinking that something is not right in Ukraine. If you’re told officially that Kravchenko committed suicide by putting a gun to his head and firing it twice, what else can you expect? That’s worse than immoral and disrespectful to people. I know that it’s hard to learn the truth in this country, so I can’t really expect to learn the truth. Here everything is rooted in falsehood. But I’m the mother of my son and I want to know where he is buried. Let me tell you again, I’m determined to do this, that’s all I want.
There are many photos showing you standing next to prominent politicians. How do you feel about politics?
L.G.: The thing is that my person and my name are being politically exploited. Messrs. Taras Stetskiv and Taras Chornovil promised to make me an honorary citizen of Ukraine and Lviv. They did this hoping to use me as their last trump card in the parliamentary campaign. They also made lots of other promises — but after getting their seats, they would look the other way whenever they saw me. I could cite many other examples. I believe that 30% of our MPs got their seats by using the name of Gongadze. This is explained by the fact that our people took my tragedy close to heart; they realized that each of them was exposed to the same threat. The Gongadze case has become a litmus paper of sorts. It shows whether you’re on the right or wrong side of the law. However, after years of false promises our people can hardly expect justice to be done to the wrongdoers. Likewise they don’t expect the next election campaign to be fair. But I will no longer allow myself to be exploited, pictured on posters standing with a parliamentary candidate. Meanwhile, I’ve never seen him before in my life and never stood next to him. The people believe this: ‘You see, Mrs. Gongadze is standing next to him; that means something.’ The only one I did support was Shkil — not him personally but his desire to help other fellows who were thrown behind bars with him. I wanted him to get a seat in the Verkhovna Rada and help release his fellow inmates. He couldn’t, and they were eventually released from jail, sick and morally crippled individuals.
Are you hoping that the West will help investigate the Gongadze case?
L.G.: My daughter-in-law Myroslava filed a complaint with the European Court three years ago, and what good did that do? No one has bothered to investigate the case. The world has its own problems to cope with. If a nation lacks leaders who are genuinely concerned about its destiny, who else will care about it? Europe is a complicated conglomerate currently haunted by its own problems. If a family can’t get itself straightened out, no one on the sidelines can help.
The seats for our MPs have been enlarged by 6 centimeters, but people who carry such bellies in front of them cannot think along lofty lines. Figuratively speaking, they’re slaves of the gastrointestinal tract. Their brain doesn’t get enough blood. I’m joking, of course, but there’s a grain of truth in every joke.
Melnychenko’s tapes are largely associated with the Gongadze case. What do you think about them?
L.G.: I know one thing. Identifying that body as my son’s means acknowledging the truth recorded on these tapes. No one wants this. I once got a phone call from someone who said he was acting on Melnychenko’s behalf. I was asked to travel abroad and meet with him. Why? What would he want from me? It was probably an attempt to lure me out of my home. Then anything could’ve happened to me on the way, considering all the loud and sincere statements I’d been making, which is my one and only privilege; I’m a lonely, unhappy woman, but at the same time I am free and independent.
I usually wear a hat. I’m an old, thin woman, and my face doesn’t look happy. Children call me Granny Shapoklyak [a negative hero of a popular Soviet cartoon]. I remember envying older women when I was a young girl, how they acted so calmly and sure of themselves, wearing nice thin gloves, makeup, smelling of expensive perfumes, exuding quiet comfort. Even then I seemed to realize that I would never be like any of them, that I’d never learn to smile so calmly, that I’d never have such exquisite gloves. Life proved me right; like thousands of other women I couldn’t meet old age feeling secure. After all, every age group has its advantages. People advanced in years have wisdom and feel liberated from many limitations that affect the younger generation. Somehow, everything has gone topsy-turvy. Now you can’t count on working hard to secure your old age; you can’t feel happy watching the sunset after a hard working day. You have to toil to earn something for your children and help them solve their problems.
You’re quite popular with journalists; they appreciate your straightforward approach; you don’t conceal any personal problems or other people’s.
L.G.: I spoke with Halyna Tereshchuk yesterday; this woman has been forced to hide from the authorities for several days. This Radio Liberty correspondent is also too outspokenly independent. That is a dangerous thing in our society. By the way, Halyna was the one who arranged for my private telephone line. Later, we’d often talk and every time I’d beg her, “Halyna, please watch out.” I used to say the same thing to my son: “Giya, be careful, bad things are happening around you.” He’d reply, “Mom, don’t worry, I know. I’ll be OK.” Some people can’t live contrary to their convictions and calling. My son was one of them.
You want to learn more about my problems? Our meters were stolen in 2000 and we were sued. I filed an injustice-and-humiliation complaint with a court of law. I returned from Kyiv exhausted. I hadn’t been home for two years. Why should I pay for 75 kWh a month? The Shevchenko District Court upheld my complaint, but the district energy distribution company appealed. In the end I was ordered to pay the electricity bills even though I never used any during the period. And then they cut off my electricity.
I’m officially registered as a tenant on Khvylovy Street. There is a city dump 30 feet from my house that burns day and night, and day and night the stench fills my apartment. I’ve been trying to solve this problem by complaining to three governors and two mayors, to no avail. I can’t live there, so I’m staying at my brother’s.
Has your pension been increased?
L.G.: I’m used to living modestly, which means I have absolutely no way to buy trinkets. Our family always lived on the verge of poverty. I remember the man who lived next door tossing chunks of sausage to his dog when we had nothing to eat. My mother would say, “Let him throw his sausage; we can’t afford it. I won’t send your father to steal it, and I won’t do it myself.” I never forgot this.
I was offered a presidential stipend and a higher retirement allowance. All those social protection ministers kept calling, asking me to accept this allowance. I told them that I’d have it only after the rest of the people have it, and that I didn’t need it as a personal favor.
Myroslava was offered 100,000 euros to waive all her grievances against Ukraine. It was meant as a bribe, so that she would keep silent. If it were a court ruling rather than Premier Tymoshenko’s offer, she would consider the possibility. As it is, it is a matter of principle and she can’t lose her clout. All these five years of expectations and sufferings can’t be measured in terms of money, and no one knows the outcome.
We’ve heard that Myroslava has a good job in the States...
L.G.: Only people poor in spirit can think that. I have spent 24 years in a strange country, I have lived in a paradise on earth made for me, but I dreamed of my homeland every day. Being in a strange land is like sharing your sweetheart’s home, which is nice, but it’s not your own. One must live and die in one’s native land.
You aren’t a Ukrainian citizen?
L.G.: No, I’m not. Why should I apply for your citizenship? I go to the same church where my great-grandfather was wed; there is a civil registrar’s record showing that my ancestors, by the name of Korchak, lived here hundreds of years ago. So why should I ask any of those in power, who have helped to destroy Ukraine, for citizenship? Deep down I’m Ukrainian anyway.
