Many experts believe that in a number of aspects Canada can serve as an example for Ukraine. In particular, it is often emphasized that Ukraine should follow the pattern of Canadian–American relations to develop its relations with Russia and implement bilingualism modeled after the Canadian pattern. Is it really possible to implement this Canadian experience in Ukraine? What are the prospects of Ukrainian–Canadian relations? What are the reasons for stability of Canada’s economy in times of global crisis? These and other questions are raised in The Day’s interview with Ambassador Extraordinary and Plenipotentiary of Canada to Ukraine G. Daniel CARON.
“WE ARE EQUIPPED WELL ENOUGH TO MEET THE CHALLENGES”
Mr. Ambassador, the economic crisis and search for ways to reduce its impact on the economy is a major headache for most of the countries. How successful is the Canadian government in meeting this challenge?
“Our financial system is well-regulated. I remember that 12–15 years ago there was a tendency when the banks insisted on amending legislation in favor of deregulation of the banking sector in order to make it more flexible. The government did not approve these proposals at that time. This was a tough decision, because liberalization and less regulation were popular at the time.
“But now we understand that the government made the right decision then, because the financial crisis has not impacted Canada. Although we are in the middle of an economic crisis, our financial system does not need any extra interference of the Canadian government. It is solid and properly prepared for the confusion that the world is experiencing.
“Our industry and economy are mostly export-oriented, and most of our exports go to the US. Since the American economy is experiencing a big crisis now, this has an effect on the Canadian economy. That is why the Canadian government is trying to help certain sectors during this difficult period.
“Unemployment is also on the rise and businesses are closing down. At the same time, we have social programs that help the population go through this. We use instruments to battle unemployment, social support programs, and universal health care system. A great emphasis is made on education. These approaches help the Canadian society overcome challenges and difficulties.”
What approach is closer to the Canadian government: the European one with increased regulation or the American one that involves economic packages, i.e., printing money?
“I think we are applying a combination of these approaches. In the banking sector we are using regulation. We have provinces that have a high degree of involvement in the economic development of regions. Like Ukraine, we have differences between the regions. Therefore, we have regional development programs and, at the same time, there is no single solution for the entire country.
“We use a special approach to eastern Canada, which depends on fishery and forestry, and a different approach to Alberta, which is located in the west and depends on the oil production and automobile industry. In other words, we use a regional approach and regulatory mechanisms. We have solid democratic and economic institutions. In spite of this, the current crisis is a challenge for the government. In particular, because of the crisis we had early parliamentary elections last year. But we are equipped well enough to meet the challenges.”
Can you explain how the minority government succeeds in meeting these challenges?
“True, the last two governments were minority governments. Therefore, it has been more difficult for them to manage these challenges. But at the same time, I want to note that these governments have been successful in conducting consultations with opposition. The governments proposed programs and initiatives, knowing that they would be heard. At the same time, they were not arrogant and did not maintain their program and no other had to be approved. They expressed their propositions and negotiated with the opposition. If it had been a majority government, it would not have had to do this. It would have approved and carried out its own programs. A minority government has to do more groundwork before introducing initiatives.”
A LOT OF POLITICS BUT FEW REFORMS
Can you assess the way the Ukrainian government is managing the current financial and economic crisis?
“A foreigner should always be delicate while expressing his/her opinion concerning other countries’ policy. You should be careful about what we are saying. After observing last week’s events (the interview was taken on June 10. — Author.), it is difficult for me to comment on them — and not only because it is about certain persons.
“This is a new democracy and its institutions are at the development stage. The reforms in your country were launched, but they haven’t yet been implemented. This new democracy has achieved immense progress. If we compare where your country was 15 years ago and where it is now, this is an immense progress.
“At the same time, it is still a new democracy. New institutions should be stronger and more democratic. Canada’s Prime Minister Kim Campbell recently visited Ukraine and said that this country’s problem is that there is too much politics and not enough governing here. Yes, you have a lot of politics, you had fair elections, and all the monitoring agencies say that there are no problems in this respect. However, you need to implement reforms and carry out changes.
“What is going on in the Verkhovna Rada is very harmful to Ukraine’s image. Institutions and the division of power between them should be more solid. As far as I understand, the entire country agrees on revising the Constitution. The president has made his proposals on March 1 in his annual speech at the Verkhovna Rada. I have not seen the prime minister’s proposals, but, as far as I understand, her team is working on a different version. They should talk to each other and try to work out a draft that will be generally accepted. I believe that this is how it will be.”
ON PARTY ALLIANCES AND COMMON VALUES
You must have heard the appeal of Ukraine’s prime minister to all the political forces to unite in order to manage the crisis. It seems that there was nothing of this kind in Canada. Why doesn’t the minority government invite the opposition parties to consolidate in order to overcome the crisis?
“I can say that last autumn the minority government issued an economic communiqu . In response, the opposition, which is made up of three parties, announced its intention to create a coalition. But this would have been a controversial step in Canada, because it is hard to imagine that two federal parties would unite with a separatist one, which wants to separate Quebec from the rest of the state. Perhaps, this kind of coalition could work for a while but not for too long. That is why a conservative party is still in power.
“Of course, parties may differ in ways of reaching aims and setting priorities. But for parties to be united in a coalition they must at least have common values and goals. And this became a certain challenge for these parties, which they have not been able to meet.”
Are Canadian politicians faced with the dilemma that is frequent in Ukrainian politics: some leaders propose emphasizing economic development, while others, social programs?
“Indeed several months before the elections one can hear in Canada statements like ‘We will introduce programs that will help the fishing or automobile industries.’ This tendency exists because parties want to be elected. It is true that short-term programs aimed at social support may be popular. We need such programs and we have them. It is better to develop them after the elections, rather than several weeks before them.
“I believe that a country should have a strong economic structure and good priorities regarding where money should be invested. This can be, for example, the high-technology and pharmaceutical sectors, science and technology, and the space industry. The energy sector is also important. We consume a lot of energy, because our country’s climate is very cold.
“The above-mentioned sectors are important, but we should also develop economic structures and social programs. We cannot say that either one or the other should be developed. One should develop certain sectors, but at the same time, when the population needs help, we cannot allow children to be out in the street. One needs to implement social programs, help the unemployed, and offer training to them and a chance to master a new profession.”
“TIME HAS COME TO STEP UP ECONOMIC AND INVESTMENT COOPERATION”
Ukraine has recently received Canada’s governor general, and last year the Ukrainian president visited Canada. In both cases it was said that these visits gave an impetus for the development the bilateral relations between our countries. How are they really developing?
“These visits were important both for Canada and for the development of bilateral relations. For example, after Viktor Yushchenko’s visit to Canada several memorandums on mutual understanding were signed and several initiatives were approved. Now, after the visit of our governor general to Ukraine, we are working on the economic sector.
“Time has come to step up economic and investment cooperation between Canada and Ukraine. Specifically, we are working on strengthening cooperation in the space industry and the energy sector. During the visit of the governor general we agreed to develop a road map that will define the key questions in the development of our bilateral relations. We want to achieve concrete results. Some of them may be short-term, whereas other, long-term. Working on the road map, we hope to sign a document this autumn that will include fairly specific issues.
“We are working on a project to increase youth mobility. The governor general is very much interested in the young generation. In Lviv she met with the representatives of the civic population, women, and children. We agreed to implement a bilateral program with Ukraine that will help young Ukrainians aged between 18 and 35 to travel to Canada, and young Canadians, to Ukraine. Thus, Canadians will know more about Ukraine and Ukrainians, about Canada.
“We would like more young Ukrainians to visit Canada, not only as tourists but also as students and interns in the federal and local authorities and in the private sector. After that young people will return to their fatherland. I am speaking about exchange, rather than a new wave of immigration. Ukrainians will return home with a greater knowledge of Canada and the operation of our institutions.”
Why won’t Canada introduce a visa-free entry for Ukrainians, considering that a large Ukrainian diaspora lives in your country?
“The visa regime questions are raised at every meeting. The same thing took place during the governor general’s meeting with the Ukrainian president. Canada does not sign any bilateral agreements concerning the visa regime. We have a unified approach toward all the countries. It is based on objective criteria, including socioeconomic and immigration factors, questions connected with documentation, border control, human rights, and bilateral relations. Therefore, a decision concerning the visa regime is based on these criteria. And now Canada does not intend to change its immigration policy.
“At the same time, I want to draw your attention to statistics. A total of 85 percent of Ukrainian applicants receive Canadian visas within a day. This is very efficient. Every year we try to improve the efficiency of visa issuance services in Ukraine. We are happy to have an immigration office in Kyiv. Not every country in this region has such an office.”
If Ukraine meets the above-mentioned criteria, can we expect that Canada will implement a visa-free regime with our country?
“I cannot answer this question, because it is the responsibility of the immigration department. I can only say that everything is changing very quickly. The situation is changing in Ukraine, in the region, and in Canada.”
“UKRAINE’S POTENTIAL HAS BEEN RECOGNIZED, AND THIS SHOULD BE UTILIZED”
You have mentioned that Canadian companies are interested in making investments in Ukraine’s economy. Why is the level of Canadian investments low, comparing to other countries, despite the fact that Canada has a large Ukrainian community?
“This question is quite important and deserves an extensive answer. Indeed, the trade relations between our countries were based primarily on the Ukrainian Canadian community, which facilitates youth exchanges, helped NGOs in Ukraine, and contributed to the trade between our countries. Now we should move on.
“Ukraine and Canada have a great potential, for example, in specific high-technology sectors. Trade tariffs or the liberalization of trade are not a problem for cooperation. We are working on this, and this may become part of the road map. The problem is that our countries are far apart and that it is difficult to make business in Ukraine.
“In certain aspects there is probably a lack of transparency: you need to find the right people to receive the necessary permissions. All this complicates business operations in Ukraine, but we are overcoming it. We have strong support from the Ukrainian government. There is a lot of room for improvement. Your country’s situation with the implementation of the rule of law, transparency, and fighting corruption needs to be improved. All these problems have been recognized. We are working with Ukraine to improve the situation.
“Personally, I have several ideas for a three- or four-year period of work. First of all, I am speaking about trade and investments. By the end of my mission I would like to say that something has been achieved in one sector or another. Time has come to do something important in the relations between our countries. For Canadians it is indeed easier to deal with Americans. They are close by, they have money, and it is easier to make business with them. But Ukraine’s potential has been recognized and this should be utilized. Another priority of mine is the development of contacts between our nations and increasing youth mobility. But we will see more in the road map.”
Don’t you think that cooperation between our countries in the nuclear energy sector may become more complicated? As is known, Canada was supposed to have larger presence in this sector, but the Ukrainian government recently struck a deal on cooperation with the Russian government.
“Yes, it is a rather complicated sphere of cooperation. Canada has better technologies and we have certain obligations concerning realization of certain projects in Ukraine. I am sure that in several years we will see the successful realization of these projects. But, as you have noted, we have competitors. Some of them are very close to Ukraine and have special relations with Ukrainians. We live in a competitive world. I am sure that you will see more of Canada in Ukraine in the short-term perspective.”
“OUR POLICY OF BILINGUALISM CANNOT BE EXPORTED TO OTHER COUNTRIES”
It would be good to hear your commentary on some experts’ proposal that Ukraine should follow the Canada–US pattern in its relations with Russia.
“In my opinion, we should be very careful while making these kinds of parallels, because relations between Canada and the US are very different from the history of bilateral relations between Russia and Ukraine. In relations with the US we had conflicts, tensions, and we still have problems where we haven’t reached a consensus.
“One of our former prime ministers once said, ‘The US is our best friend, whether we like it or not. We have no choice.’ And this is a challenge. For some governments it was easier to smooth out their irritation, while for others it was more difficult. Can you imagine that two neighboring countries that are close, have quite an extensive common border, and have never had any historical conflicts, were unable come to consensus concerning creation of a free trade zone for more than 10 years?”
You have mentioned Kim Campbell. In one of her interviews to the Ukrainian mass media she said that official bilingualism is a way to preserve the Ukrainian state within the existing borders. Do you agree with this? In your opinion, is it possible that the Canadian experience of bilingualism be implemented in Ukraine?
“This is a very good question. I asked myself this question when I arrived here. I didn’t know anything about Ukraine’s language policy. Again, we cannot make parallels. Why did Canada become a bilingual country and fairly recently at that? It happened in the mid-1970s. Canada had no official language before then. Most of civil employees knew only one language, English. Bilingualism was implemented in Canada in order to recognize that we have both Francophone and Anglophone communities and to prove that we are a modern state. This had to be recognized officially in the Canadian Parliament and Canadian institutions.
“This does not mean that Canada is bilingual everywhere. Two more languages are used in Canada that are very important: Italian and Ukrainian. We have Ukrainian schools that are open for the whole week, not only on Saturdays. The implementation of bilingualism was a response to the national movement of the Francophone population, which makes 27 percent of Canada’s entire population.
“Our bilingualism policy cannot be exported to other countries. For example, Belgium also has a language problem. I don’t think that similar regulatory acts as we have in Canada should be implemented there. These acts may be good, but I am not sure that they can be applied everywhere. Ukraine should develop its own language policy, which is based on the current situation, but also takes into account the past of this country.
“What is important to take into consideration and what is part to the Ukrainian and Canadian experience is the respect for the minorities, different ethnic groups that make up the nation and the country. Therefore, both Canada and Ukraine should facilitate the development of minority languages and preservation of the minority cultures and history.
“Language is a very sensitive issue. I come from Francophone Canada and consider myself Canadian, but I am very proud that I come from Quebec. Respect for minorities is very important for Ukraine.”
But shouldn’t minorities respect the majority?
“Surely. In Canada we have many new Canadians from different cultures. And they should respect the Canadian values. You are right in saying that the majority should respect the minority, and vice versa. I can give you a good example. We welcome new Canadians with their culture, music, and history. But if they bring values that are not consistent with ours, they should adjust. ”
