Traditionally Britain is perceived as one of the European community members which has always backed Ukraine’s accession to the EU and NATO. However, two and a half months later the United Kingdom will vote in a referendum on its EU membership. Many wonder why Brits are so anxious to break loose from the EU and if this decision is prompted by island mentality or some other factors. This question actually opened the blitz interview with the British conservative politician Malcolm RIFKIND, who recently participated in the Kyiv Security Forum.
“FOR MANY HUNDREDS OF YEARS, ALL THE DECISIONS HAVE BEEN TAKEN BY OUR OWN NATIONAL PARLIAMENT”
“The main, the single most important reason is that Britain has been a very lucky country. For many hundreds of years, all the decisions that affect our people have been taken by our own national parliament in a democratic way. So, to be part in an organization where you have to share decisions – not on foreign policy, but on domestic issues, on things that happen in your own country – a lot of people don’t like that. But I think the likely result of the referendum will be that the British people will be willing to stay in the European Union. Because the EU itself is changing, it is becoming more of a partnership of nations rather than trying to become a single state like America. So, the more Europe moves in that direction, the more people in the United Kingdom will be very comfortable.”
I hear from some British experts that the main division line between the UK and the Continent is the dominance of the Napoleonic Code in the EU and of the Anglo-Saxon model in Britain and the US. What do you think of it?
“Yes, of course, there are historical differences, we are an island, traditionally we have a close relationship with the United States, and Napoleon never reached London. So, you’re right, these are differences, but that is history. I think most people are more concerned with today and tomorrow, and they recognize that on some decisions, Europe, including Britain, must try to speak with a single voice: on foreign policy, on environmental issues, on energy issues, on trade, on the single market – these are international issues. But European Union has also become too involved in other matters – in the taxes we pay, in the laws that citizens live under: how long people can work, what the conditions of employment should be, matters of that kind. And in Britain, and in some other European countries, people ask: ‘Why should that be decided by Europe? Why should we have the same law in Portugal, Britain, Latvia?’ In the United States, which is one country, in California, some things are different from Texas. And if that can be true of the United States, which is one state, it should also be true in Europe.”
So you think that the United States of Europe is an idee fixe?
“We will never like that. To be fair, most people in Europe don’t want a United States of Europe, including the governments, but we have moved in that direction. Once you have a single currency, that is a big decision, we [UK] are not part of the single currency, but once you have a single currency, you are increasingly going to have a single economic policy, a single interest rates, a single monetary policy. You are then saying: ‘Well, maybe, we need a European government?’ And that we are not very keen on.”
“THE ONLY PERSON WHO WILL BE PLEASEDIF BRITAIN LEFT THE EUROPEAN UNION WILL BE MR. PUTIN”
Did Europe adequately respond to Russia’s aggression in Ukraine?
“Well, I think that the only person who will be pleased if Britain left the European Union will be Mr. Putin in Moscow, because he doesn’t like Europe speaking with a single voice. He would like the fragmentation of Europe, and if Britain were to leave – one of the major countries – that will be a big step in that direction that he would like. That is another good reason for Britain not to leave the European Union.”
Do you think the West is capable of influencing Russia to make it change its behavior towards Ukraine?
“I would like that Putin realizes he must work with the international community, not against it. It is difficult to believe that is going to happen, because what he has chosen in the last few years is to go in the other direction. And by his aggression in Crimea, in eastern Ukraine, in Georgia, cyber attacks on Estonia – it is all part of a single strategy, which is very damaging, very destabilizing.”
Maybe, Putin decided to make Russia into an indispensable country, just like George W. Bush did in his time, when not a single problem in the world could be solved without the US. However, to this end he began creating problems to help solve them later. What do you think of it?
“I didn’t always agree with president Bush, but what he was trying to do was to make the world more stable, not to make it unstable, to make it more democratic, not undemocratic, so I would not compare Bush with Putin. I disagreed with some of Bush’s policy, but he was a man who was trying to make the world a better place. I have not yet believed that is what Mr. Putin wants.”
“UKRAINE HAS TO HAVE A PROPER DEBATE WHAT IS THE BEST SECURITY MODEL FOR UKRAINE”
Britain traditionally has been more benevolent towards Ukraine and supported both Ukraine’s membership in the EU and in NATO. What is London’s current policy in this respect like?
“Well, European Union and NATO are different organizations. So, where the European Union is concerned, I hope that Ukraine will become increasingly part of the European Union, it will take some time. NATO is even more difficult, because NATO is a military alliance, and it will be a long number of years before that decision could be reached. Also, if you look at Europe, different countries reach different decisions about whether they want to join a military alliance: Switzerland, Sweden, Austria, Finland – they are just as concerned about their independence, they don’t want to join NATO. They could have, if they wanted to, but they chose not to. So, Ukraine has to have a proper debate what is the best security model for Ukraine. But it must be for the Ukrainians to decide, not the Russians.”
